The Chaco cut is relatively new to me, so I've only gotten her to about week 4 in flower. This is the thread from Chaco all about the ECSD. Given that Chaco has chronicled his experience with the cut (it's just ECSD, not something he made) and cemented his cut as "legit", as it spread from him, adding the "(Chaco's cut)" just pays homage to someone with a verified copy. Similar to Chemdog'91(Skunk VA), in that the guy "Skunk VA" did not make or pop the Chem'91, just a guy who held on to the cut and is generally accepted to be
the original representation.
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=148035
I got the Rattlesnake Diesel from a friend with very little info about it. All he told me was that his source is a very well traveled fellow that holds many rare cuts and routinely supplies breeders of high esteem; the Rattlesnake Diesel is an old West Coast Laytonville Sour Diesel.
In researching, I couldn't find much about the cut. I saw that there is another strain that goes by the same name that is a C99 cross, but it's a more modern thing not at all related to this cut. I did find that there is a Rattlesnake Summit around Laytonville, so I'd guess that's how this cut got the name.
The other Sour Diesel cut, from Asshole Joe (AJ's Sour D), is another variant that I have access to, but haven't gotten ahold of yet.
Sour Diesel lineage is a real mf'er to nail down because there are so many purported lines involved. I've seen variations of Chem'91, DNL, Mass Super Skunk, Hawaiian x NL, RFK Skunk, Original Diesel, etc. supposed to be involved. Unfortunately, in the case of Sour Diesel it was a fluke of a creation. The Sour D seed came from a hermie scenario. Being that it was unintentional in a room of various strains with hermie tendencies, there is no definitive answer.
The following is written with information gathered over time, these accounts of history may have been amended by the various parties since my reading these things or warped by my memory. So take this with a grain of salt.
JJ-NYC (Top Dawg Seeds) has said that the seed originates with some of his friends and remains adamant that it is a RFK Skunk/Hawaiian X NL. I've read an account about Mass G (Chemdog, the guy) claiming that the seed came from his room and that it is Chem'91(skva) x Mass Super Skunk. So, we have 2 well known/respected growers/breeders that have conflicting origin stories. I've also seen (Chem'91(skva) x Mass SS) x NL5, so
. Another variable at play here is that the names of cuts were changed back and forth using similar monikers to describe main ingredients (I've seen Chemdog go by "Diesel" as well as the incremental steps toward Sour Diesel called "Original Diesel").
Now, here's where I'll take the liberty to pull some opinions from my ass and offer some observations from my own experience with related genetics and what could be involved in the Sour Diesel. To reiterate, this is just me spitballing, and is in no way intended to be an authoritative account of what the hell is in the Sour Diesel.
Long story short: No one can say for certain what the lineage is, and even the people closest to the genesis have varied responses over time. I think it’s closer to Chem’91 x Mass SS.
Short story long:
When I grew out Appalachian Super Skunk (
Mass Super Skunk x Appalachia) I got many phenos with sour/citrus terps. Appalachia is (
Green Crack x Tresdawg); GC is not citrusy and I'd be shocked if Tresdawg would bring that smell considering it's a
Chem D BX2. So, I would credit the Mass SS for imparting that smell. I've never experienced any citrus terps from other Bodhi Appalachia crosses, so this reinforces my MSS assumption.
The genetics behind Giesel are less contested than Sour D and was made by Mass G crossing (
Chem D x Mass Super Skunk). Since Mass G created this one, he named it as a shortened, “G’s Diesel” to create Giesel. So it hints that a Diesel recipe follows a Chemdog crossed to Mass SS.
In this scenario, I have Chem D so I know what traits to attribute to her when observing the Giesel. She has a citrus note to her profile, similar to the citrus I smell in the Appy SS phenos. It’s not a specific citrus fruit (orange, lemon, lime), but a generic acidic citrus that gives a “sour” aspect to the nose. This terp is not a Chem D attribute as she’s more funky/rank.
I also have Chocolate Diesel (
Chocolate Thai (Katsu cut) x Sour Diesel IBL 1.5) that smells nothing like chocolate, but is very sour apple citrus smell. But since the Sour D used in this one was a Rez Sour Diesel BX using NYC Diesel to do original outcross, I can’t say whether the sour citrus note is coming from the Grapefruit terps of the NYC Diesel or a reinforced Mass SS trait expressing from backcrossing.
Some are adamant that the tall stretch of the Sour D is thanks to a Hawaiian, but the Chem’91 has a solid stretch that could explain the “bean pole” structure. I find the Sour D lineage explanations that don’t include the Chem’91 to be very hard to believe. The Sour D’s bud structure (
both Rattlesnake and ECSD) looks so similar to the Skunk VA cut of Chemdog with the mint green calyxes and small dark oily secondary/tertiary leaves that poke out between floral clusters and cup inward.
The differences I’ve observed between the ECSD and Rattlesnake are mainly structural. Whether this means they are different phenos from the original population of hermie seeds that spawned the Sour D, the same cut that has drifted to some degree, or something else entirely is just speculation.
The Rattlesnake Diesel structure takes on more of a “Skunk” frame with a main apical stem surrounded by secondary branching that generally stays below the main stem. While the ECSD acts more like the Chemdog or an OG with shared dominance among many branches that can equally fill a canopy. Both cuts will branch easily, it just seems as though the Rattlesnake prefers to have a main top.
For smell, I’ll generalize and say that Sour Diesel is mainly comprised of two notes, Fuel and “Sour” (think generic citrus sour). Rattlesnake seems to have a more pronounced sour profile, where the ECSD has more fuel to the balance.
The best way to describe it, assuming the Sour D is (Chem’91 x Mass SS), is that the Rattlesnake Diesel seems like it leans toward the Mass SS, while the ECSD leans more toward the Chem’91. Again, this makes many assumptions, but it’s a decent way of striking the difference between them.
I don't keep the Rattlesnake in constant rotation, because she takes awhile to finish and no one is interested in the premium that goes into that (
different topic for a different discussion), so my pictures of her are somewhere on an external hard drive full of older grow pics. I was only able to find a group shot pic with some Rattlesnakes in the back row . You can see that she has a solid stretch.
Let me know if you're as intrigued as I am about this. I am willing to dedicate time and space to such an endeavor.