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Schwaggy P's Random Stuff
- Thread starter Schwaggy P
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Strawberry Cough - Day 72
Fruity strains aren't my main focus, but this cut has the most amazing smell. I almost groan when a strain has a fruit in its name because most times there's a passing hint at best of the fruit in the smell, but this smells like a bowl of fresh cut strawberries with sugar sprinkled on top, very intense. Definitely a cut that makes you appreciate the possibilities of this plant.
Fruity strains aren't my main focus, but this cut has the most amazing smell. I almost groan when a strain has a fruit in its name because most times there's a passing hint at best of the fruit in the smell, but this smells like a bowl of fresh cut strawberries with sugar sprinkled on top, very intense. Definitely a cut that makes you appreciate the possibilities of this plant.
Phylex
PICK YOUR OWN
With the plethora of knowledge you not only have but are always willing to share, I swear Schwaggy, I'm convinced you're the next gen Ed Rosenthal. I'm sure any iconic name could have been inserted, but I chose Mr. Rosenthal because one of his books was the first one I purchased in the 90's and I've always considered him a "guru." At some point the iconic "gurus" will no longer be with us, and someone is going to emerge to carry that torch. It certainly seems like you my friend can easily be that guy.The Chaco cut is relatively new to me, so I've only gotten her to about week 4 in flower. This is the thread from Chaco all about the ECSD. Given that Chaco has chronicled his experience with the cut (it's just ECSD, not something he made) and cemented his cut as "legit", as it spread from him, adding the "(Chaco's cut)" just pays homage to someone with a verified copy. Similar to Chemdog'91(Skunk VA), in that the guy "Skunk VA" did not make or pop the Chem'91, just a guy who held on to the cut and is generally accepted to be the original representation.
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=148035
I got the Rattlesnake Diesel from a friend with very little info about it. All he told me was that his source is a very well traveled fellow that holds many rare cuts and routinely supplies breeders of high esteem; the Rattlesnake Diesel is an old West Coast Laytonville Sour Diesel.
In researching, I couldn't find much about the cut. I saw that there is another strain that goes by the same name that is a C99 cross, but it's a more modern thing not at all related to this cut. I did find that there is a Rattlesnake Summit around Laytonville, so I'd guess that's how this cut got the name.
The other Sour Diesel cut, from Asshole Joe (AJ's Sour D), is another variant that I have access to, but haven't gotten ahold of yet.
Sour Diesel lineage is a real mf'er to nail down because there are so many purported lines involved. I've seen variations of Chem'91, DNL, Mass Super Skunk, Hawaiian x NL, RFK Skunk, Original Diesel, etc. supposed to be involved. Unfortunately, in the case of Sour Diesel it was a fluke of a creation. The Sour D seed came from a hermie scenario. Being that it was unintentional in a room of various strains with hermie tendencies, there is no definitive answer.
The following is written with information gathered over time, these accounts of history may have been amended by the various parties since my reading these things or warped by my memory. So take this with a grain of salt.
JJ-NYC (Top Dawg Seeds) has said that the seed originates with some of his friends and remains adamant that it is a RFK Skunk/Hawaiian X NL. I've read an account about Mass G (Chemdog, the guy) claiming that the seed came from his room and that it is Chem'91(skva) x Mass Super Skunk. So, we have 2 well known/respected growers/breeders that have conflicting origin stories. I've also seen (Chem'91(skva) x Mass SS) x NL5, so. Another variable at play here is that the names of cuts were changed back and forth using similar monikers to describe main ingredients (I've seen Chemdog go by "Diesel" as well as the incremental steps toward Sour Diesel called "Original Diesel").
Now, here's where I'll take the liberty to pull some opinions from my ass and offer some observations from my own experience with related genetics and what could be involved in the Sour Diesel. To reiterate, this is just me spitballing, and is in no way intended to be an authoritative account of what the hell is in the Sour Diesel.
Long story short: No one can say for certain what the lineage is, and even the people closest to the genesis have varied responses over time. I think it’s closer to Chem’91 x Mass SS.
Short story long:
When I grew out Appalachian Super Skunk (Mass Super Skunk x Appalachia) I got many phenos with sour/citrus terps. Appalachia is (Green Crack x Tresdawg); GC is not citrusy and I'd be shocked if Tresdawg would bring that smell considering it's a Chem D BX2. So, I would credit the Mass SS for imparting that smell. I've never experienced any citrus terps from other Bodhi Appalachia crosses, so this reinforces my MSS assumption.
The genetics behind Giesel are less contested than Sour D and was made by Mass G crossing (Chem D x Mass Super Skunk). Since Mass G created this one, he named it as a shortened, “G’s Diesel” to create Giesel. So it hints that a Diesel recipe follows a Chemdog crossed to Mass SS.
In this scenario, I have Chem D so I know what traits to attribute to her when observing the Giesel. She has a citrus note to her profile, similar to the citrus I smell in the Appy SS phenos. It’s not a specific citrus fruit (orange, lemon, lime), but a generic acidic citrus that gives a “sour” aspect to the nose. This terp is not a Chem D attribute as she’s more funky/rank.
I also have Chocolate Diesel (Chocolate Thai (Katsu cut) x Sour Diesel IBL 1.5) that smells nothing like chocolate, but is very sour apple citrus smell. But since the Sour D used in this one was a Rez Sour Diesel BX using NYC Diesel to do original outcross, I can’t say whether the sour citrus note is coming from the Grapefruit terps of the NYC Diesel or a reinforced Mass SS trait expressing from backcrossing.
Some are adamant that the tall stretch of the Sour D is thanks to a Hawaiian, but the Chem’91 has a solid stretch that could explain the “bean pole” structure. I find the Sour D lineage explanations that don’t include the Chem’91 to be very hard to believe. The Sour D’s bud structure (both Rattlesnake and ECSD) looks so similar to the Skunk VA cut of Chemdog with the mint green calyxes and small dark oily secondary/tertiary leaves that poke out between floral clusters and cup inward.
The differences I’ve observed between the ECSD and Rattlesnake are mainly structural. Whether this means they are different phenos from the original population of hermie seeds that spawned the Sour D, the same cut that has drifted to some degree, or something else entirely is just speculation.
The Rattlesnake Diesel structure takes on more of a “Skunk” frame with a main apical stem surrounded by secondary branching that generally stays below the main stem. While the ECSD acts more like the Chemdog or an OG with shared dominance among many branches that can equally fill a canopy. Both cuts will branch easily, it just seems as though the Rattlesnake prefers to have a main top.
For smell, I’ll generalize and say that Sour Diesel is mainly comprised of two notes, Fuel and “Sour” (think generic citrus sour). Rattlesnake seems to have a more pronounced sour profile, where the ECSD has more fuel to the balance.
The best way to describe it, assuming the Sour D is (Chem’91 x Mass SS), is that the Rattlesnake Diesel seems like it leans toward the Mass SS, while the ECSD leans more toward the Chem’91. Again, this makes many assumptions, but it’s a decent way of striking the difference between them.
I don't keep the Rattlesnake in constant rotation, because she takes awhile to finish and no one is interested in the premium that goes into that (different topic for a different discussion), so my pictures of her are somewhere on an external hard drive full of older grow pics. I was only able to find a group shot pic with some Rattlesnakes in the back row . You can see that she has a solid stretch.
Jtgreen
Active Member
A friend of mine got a bag of strawberry cough years back and just one hit you knew what it was w/o being told
Those are some big shoes to fill
. Thank you, I'm always eager to talk cannabis.Her smell has progressed through flower very similarly to how a fruit matures. Early on she had a generically "berry" smell. Then in the latter half, she starts to differentiate into a strawberry specific profile but still immature. Then around day 65, the sweetness starts to ripen and it's full on sweet strawberries.
Phylex
PICK YOUR OWN
And when you do, I always stop to listen. I'm sure there's a lot of folks that can relate and attest to that. Whenever it's warranted, it's evident in the amount of time you put into your thorough responses. They're very well written, full of information, and helpful. All the thanks goes to you.Those are some big shoes to fill
H.A.F.
a.k.a. Rusty Nails
This "mass-microbrew" of strains hitting all markets is only over the past 10 years or so (nationwide, I know it's been there...) and already people are "getting back to landrace" or as close as they can find.
Do you think that there is too much cross breeding? Everyone seems to have a hand in it, pro and noob alike (I'll be one soon LOL) but eventually, if the genetics keep getting thinned out will this be a bad thing?
I use it as meds, I like the new higher harder poly's, as I want or need strongest meds possible. The preservationist folks can go hike and search all they want, I don't mind how the plant has been modified or just bred and spread. Funny thing, the cannabis plant is still rockin hard after all these yrs, in many ways, shapes, and forms. Jmo
Sorry nothing on the strawberry soda/milkshake. I grew out Bodhi's Strawberry Lotus (Strawberry Milk x Snow Lotus) and didn't really find anything "strawberry-y" or keeper, but it was only one pack. I'm only aware of one SFV OG, so I'd have to wait to grow her out since she was just recently acquired. I'd like to grow out all my "pure" OG's together to get an idea of what's going on with them (TK, HAOG, Josh D, SFV, Loompa HB).
I keep the Gelato45 mostly because she is a crowd pleaser. She has a solid balanced stone, relaxes your body and lets to just space out. The effect lasts about 1.5hrs. It's not really a jar I personally reach for too often, but she's a solid midday smoke.
Much appreciatedAnd when you do, I always stop to listen. I'm sure there's a lot of folks that can relate and attest to that. Whenever it's warranted, it's evident in the amount of time you put into your thorough responses. They're very well written, full of information, and helpful. All the thanks goes to you.
I think the most important factor deciding how things progress is honesty in what is going into new creations. There's going to be more going on as legalization and genetics proliferate through social media, etc. so I think the explosion in new "stuff" is unavoidable. But as long as everyone is being forthright with what they are working with and how they created what they are offering, it becomes easier to track how things are progressing whether being "watered down" or just slightly improved.
One of my personal pet peeves is not labeling S1 genetics appropriately. For example, if you buy and grow out a Chem'91 S1 and decide to use it in a cross, don't try to be slick and drop the "S1". While it may be similar, or hell even better, than the original Chem'91, it's not the same genetic. I think these "slight of hand" moves are what really creates the problems with losing track of genetics or misrepresenting things. If I call something Chemdog'91 which really Chemdog'91 S1, then I'm misrepresenting the cut and could risk giving it a bad name if others find the progeny lacking. This would result in misappropriating traits to cuts/strains that would have been unavoidable if properly labeled.
That could very well contribute to issues. I don't have the Rattlesnake in regular rotation because while some may want longer flowering buds, they aren't always keen on paying higher price. While I can appreciate their preferences, I'm not going to be subsidizing them.Seriously, there are some stupid people that also grow weed - there are also people that can't spend 3-4 months on a grow and then say "well, that sucks!" and take it out of the rotation.
While I can appreciate the landrace and more monogenetic preservations, I prefer the next step in cannabis breeding. By this I mean that period between 1980-2000 where you had little known types as well as SSSC, Sensi, etc. working the landraces into what we now consider "old-school" strains. The stuff that is better acclimated to indoor growing, but still has a very unique character all their own. I find the modern, especially cookie based things to not differentiate enough from each other. It's as if they are all just slightly different phenos of the same recessive OG.
You're welcome!
H.A.F.
a.k.a. Rusty Nails
@Schwaggy P Thanks for the well explained reply.
I'm a flower grower, but am going to try one run of seeds. I have some cross-breed reggies (Royal Mystery) that I already did a run of for flower and I love it - produced the flowers in my avatar. I want to F1 that strain (I think?)
I also have some fem seeds from ILGM that I have grown out and like. My main considerations in the crosses I am planning with fem seeds from that RM (F2?) has been stature (keep it short), and flower-time (shorten it because the RM is a 70+ day flower, the ILGM's are closer to 56).
So far I am considering Superskunk, Bruce Banner and Black Widow as the fems to cross.
I also have Skywalker OG (a little too much dirt taste for me but rocking the THC) and GDP (the ILGM version is a shrub, leafy as hell, no stretch)
This is a one-and-done seed run then back to flowers, so any insight would be appreciated.
I'm a flower grower, but am going to try one run of seeds. I have some cross-breed reggies (Royal Mystery) that I already did a run of for flower and I love it - produced the flowers in my avatar. I want to F1 that strain (I think?)
I also have some fem seeds from ILGM that I have grown out and like. My main considerations in the crosses I am planning with fem seeds from that RM (F2?) has been stature (keep it short), and flower-time (shorten it because the RM is a 70+ day flower, the ILGM's are closer to 56).
So far I am considering Superskunk, Bruce Banner and Black Widow as the fems to cross.
I also have Skywalker OG (a little too much dirt taste for me but rocking the THC) and GDP (the ILGM version is a shrub, leafy as hell, no stretch)
This is a one-and-done seed run then back to flowers, so any insight would be appreciated.
