The Upward Spyral

[Uncle Romulus]

Thanks Tex. Interesting. It's 4000K though, I want in the 3000s. I think these lights are going to make a difference. I said I wasn't going to get more HID unless I ran into a deal I couldn't pass up and here I am. Just gotta see it on through. I'm really liking this arsenal of light types to mix up the spectrums and whatnot.

I find the 4200k kinda poopoo compared to the 3100k all around. You are gonna love the cmhs. A 315 almost replace a 600 and the full spectrum brings out the best. Little bit leafier Buds tho but add in 90 watts of 2700k 15 watt led bulbs or run with hps for best leaf/bud ratio. (To keep it on the cheap). A far red puck or two of sorts would do the trick also. I’m nitpicking here cause cmh alone does fine it’s just better combined with some more lows imo

 

[Uncle Romulus]

Now that I’m thinking about it your viparspecs have plenty of reds eh?

 

[spyralout]

Now that I’m thinking about it your viparspecs have plenty of reds eh?

The par series have more white too. Maybe one of each series and a cmh? Or one hps one cmh one viparspectra?
I agree the mix of spectrum to a certain extent has to do something good. In nature the plant has the sun which is truly full spectrum and maybe some spectrums help the plant in ways other than just sheer growth/mass.
I definitely plan on a cmh and hps in the garage

 

[spyralout]

Guys my gf mighta found some air cooled hps hoods for like $10 lol. Hope they're decent. Use the glass or take it off, I don't think I should run fan air through it over the bulb ala hps?

 

[Texagonian]

I ran air cooled 1k hps for years man. Never had an issue with blowing bulbs. My 315 cmh is an air cooled unit and I have it hooked up. Keeping the tent at 76 degrees lights on. I just don’t like the lense. I took it off and the temp rose a bit which wasn’t a problem but the humidity went way too high so it’s back on. Just my 2. If your gonna run the cmh lights in them and just get the bulb adapter socket you may not need to worry about running a fan over them or keeping the lense on. Finding some scores! Must be all the people who fled up here since the market fell out. I was finding all kinds of stuff hella cheap and now it’s back up.

 

[spyralout]

A lot of the prices have been rising. Might be because it's getting cooler. We just happen to be on the lookout for this kinda stuff to save money where we can. Lights are the main thing we're needing right now.
I just remember reading somewhere about not running air over a cmh bulb because the cooling effect changes its color or something, IDK.

 

[Texagonian]

Hmm, I don’t know about that. I got my gear from sunlight supply when they were moving from one warehouse to another and it’s one of their air cooled setups. I hope it doesn’t change it, that would suck!

 

[SoLowDoughLow]

A lot of the prices have been rising. Might be because it's getting cooler. We just happen to be on the lookout for this kinda stuff to save money where we can. Lights are the main thing we're needing right now.
I just remember reading somewhere about not running air over a cmh bulb because the cooling effect changes its color or something, IDK.

Yea, I think you're right. I know for my DE hps, its not supposed to be air cooled. I think they make special hoods to cool double ended fixtures without actually blowing air over the bulb.

 

[SoLowDoughLow]

Anyway, my point was, I think it's just double ended fixtures that can't be traditionally air cooled

 

[Texagonian]

I just inspected my hood and the air is moving over and around the reflector and the ballast which is internal. Maybe that’s why mine is air cooled. I dunno Good conversation guys. Making my brain tick. Time to do some homework

 

[Phylex]

When running my 1000w HPS I used an air cooled hood and glass cover without issue. I pulled air through the hood. Like @Texagonian just mentioned, maybe it flows around the reflector. I've never looked at that. I'm also not running a DE HPS.

 

[spyralout]

I only read about it for CMH not sure if it was referring to DE only but I don't remember them mentioning that. They did mention a vertical hanging CMH is better but not necessary for it to function correctly.

 

[Jewels]

I am going out on the independent thought limb here.

I call BS on the no aircool thing.
I mean really,,,why ?

Question everything.
Is the bulb going to fail if it gets a little windy?

Will we ever see a warning sticker that says, "Caution- to be used in still air only?
-Will the forensic autopsy confirm "windburn " as cause of death ?
"I am sorry sir, you warranty is void , due to operation in drafty conditions"

It is just air molecules flying around.
Perhaps unrelated but; T5's T4's and all good ole tube bulbs produce more light towards the centre - because the centre is cooler.

The only logic I see in that advice might be that the dust accumulation is more detrimental to the bulb, than benefits gainrd by running cooler?
Kinda a stretch - dunno

I make shit up. Suits me fine.
I am the Lord of my cerebral manor. There is no space for rent in my head.

 

[gwheels]

4200 bulbs will start to finish but i find they make leafy buds. 3100 is better full run but the 4200 bulb vegs really well.
And PhillIps bulbs all the way. 3100 start to finish forever and you get some UV in there for sparkly finish.
Your flood and drains are really sweet man.
What TDS are you running (excluding your water)?
My tap water is 650 today it is why i got the RO machine and it is now 10ppm but i am having trouble with the TDS. I cant stop myself from getting to 1000.
Its worse than a seed addiction.

Killawatt meters are GREAT. I use mine for light adjustments on boards because that screw turn is tough to gauge.

 

[spyralout]

4200 bulbs will start to finish but i find they make leafy buds. 3100 is better full run but the 4200 bulb vegs really well.
And PhillIps bulbs all the way. 3100 start to finish forever and you get some UV in there for sparkly finish.
Your flood and drains are really sweet man.
What TDS are you running (excluding your water)?
My tap water is 650 today it is why i got the RO machine and it is now 10ppm but i am having trouble with the TDS. I cant stop myself from getting to 1000.
Its worse than a seed addiction.

Killawatt meters are GREAT. I use mine for light adjustments on boards because that screw turn is tough to gauge.

Thanks G i appreciate that! About 400-500 each tote is different right now. I will start pushing more when I get RO in them.
I have 2 more F&D on standby for the next seeds. Light is my issue right now. That should hopefully be cleared up (for now) soon

 

[spyralout]

I am going out on the independent thought limb here.

I call BS on the no aircool thing.
I mean really,,,why ?

Question everything.
Is the bulb going to fail if it gets a little windy?

Will we ever see a warning sticker that says, "Caution- to be used in still air only?
-Will the forensic autopsy confirm "windburn " as cause of death ?
"I am sorry sir, you warranty is void , due to operation in drafty conditions"

It is just air molecules flying around.
Perhaps unrelated but; T5's T4's and all good ole tube bulbs produce more light towards the centre - because the centre is cooler.

The only logic I see in that advice might be that the dust accumulation is more detrimental to the bulb, than benefits gainrd by running cooler?
Kinda a stretch - dunno

I make shit up. Suits me fine.
I am the Lord of my cerebral manor. There is no space for rent in my head.

You make logical sense. But sometimes like whiskey, too much can start to lose its desired effect lol. Like with anything experience is the best teacher

 

[Jewels]

maybe some spectrums help the plant in ways other than just sheer growth/mass.

Hell yeah !

Overlay top image with any bottom image, for light source effectivness.

Figure S3. Normalized spectral power distributions of 10 commercialized types of lighting and daylight. (a) a CW pc-LED (cool-white pc-LED),
(b) WW pc-LED (warm-white pc-LED),
(c) an incandescent lamp, (d) an FL 1 (halophosphate FL, 6,480 K),
(e) an FL 2 (halophosphate FL, 4,290 K),
(f) an FL 3 (triphosphor FL, 3,380 K),
(g) an MH (metal-halide), (h) an HPS lamp (high-pressure sodium),
(i) an LPS lamp (low-pressure sodium),
(j) a mercury lamp,
(k) daylight, and
(l) sunrise and sunset

,,,
remember my friends, plants dont give AF about CRI.

Random, unrelated thought of the day.
@Uncle Romulus actually enjoys better sunsets than were do. As you ascend further North the evening sky pushes up over 65k. If you hit the right latitude @ the right season, the sky is the deepest electric blue 24/7 for a couple weeks every year.

 

[Uncle Romulus]

Hell yeah !
View attachment 22447
Overlay top image with any bottom image, for light source effectivness.
View attachment 22446
Figure S3. Normalized spectral power distributions of 10 commercialized types of lighting and daylight. (a) a CW pc-LED (cool-white pc-LED),
(b) WW pc-LED (warm-white pc-LED),
(c) an incandescent lamp, (d) an FL 1 (halophosphate FL, 6,480 K),
(e) an FL 2 (halophosphate FL, 4,290 K),
(f) an FL 3 (triphosphor FL, 3,380 K),
(g) an MH (metal-halide), (h) an HPS lamp (high-pressure sodium),
(i) an LPS lamp (low-pressure sodium),
(j) a mercury lamp,
(k) daylight, and
(l) sunrise and sunset

,,,
remember my friends, plants dont give AF about CRI.

Random, unrelated thought of the day.
@Uncle Romulus actually enjoys better sunsets than were do. As you ascend further North the evening sky pushes up over 65k. If you hit the right latitude @ the right season, the sky is the deepest electric blue 24/7 for a couple weeks every year.

u comin to visit? we can hold hands and look at the sky

 

[SoLowDoughLow]

I am going out on the independent thought limb here.

I call BS on the no aircool thing.
I mean really,,,why ?

Question everything.
Is the bulb going to fail if it gets a little windy?

Will we ever see a warning sticker that says, "Caution- to be used in still air only?
-Will the forensic autopsy confirm "windburn " as cause of death ?
"I am sorry sir, you warranty is void , due to operation in drafty conditions"

It is just air molecules flying around.
Perhaps unrelated but; T5's T4's and all good ole tube bulbs produce more light towards the centre - because the centre is cooler.

The only logic I see in that advice might be that the dust accumulation is more detrimental to the bulb, than benefits gainrd by running cooler?
Kinda a stretch - dunno

I make shit up. Suits me fine.
I am the Lord of my cerebral manor. There is no space for rent in my head.

It's not that you can't, they just don't recommend it cuz it fucks with the par or efficiency or some shit lol, probably not really enough to notice

But it's also why gavita doesn't have air cooled hoods

 

[spyralout]

Hell yeah !
View attachment 22447
Overlay top image with any bottom image, for light source effectivness.
View attachment 22446
Figure S3. Normalized spectral power distributions of 10 commercialized types of lighting and daylight. (a) a CW pc-LED (cool-white pc-LED),
(b) WW pc-LED (warm-white pc-LED),
(c) an incandescent lamp, (d) an FL 1 (halophosphate FL, 6,480 K),
(e) an FL 2 (halophosphate FL, 4,290 K),
(f) an FL 3 (triphosphor FL, 3,380 K),
(g) an MH (metal-halide), (h) an HPS lamp (high-pressure sodium),
(i) an LPS lamp (low-pressure sodium),
(j) a mercury lamp,
(k) daylight, and
(l) sunrise and sunset

,,,
remember my friends, plants dont give AF about CRI.

Random, unrelated thought of the day.
@Uncle Romulus actually enjoys better sunsets than were do. As you ascend further North the evening sky pushes up over 65k. If you hit the right latitude @ the right season, the sky is the deepest electric blue 24/7 for a couple weeks every year.

Very interesting charts. I would like to see the new LED tech charted. Still wonder about the actual effects to the plants in the non blue/red zones. Like if it isn't mass/growth is it something like color of the plant (I've seen purple patches on stems where the light hits) or some "plant physiology" thing. Kinda like how @Schwaggy P posted about the test plants that emitted fear when they saw neighbor's killer come back to the area. Maybe it builds higher immunity/resistance to disease and pests?

What do you think about this statement:

CRI is a numeric indication of a lamp’s ability to render the full color spectrum accurately.
The higher the CRI the more natural and vibrant the full spectrum of colors are.
A bulb with a CRI of 95 or higher is excellent for growing; the sun has a CRI of 100.

Which brings up another thought. We know the color of the light makes a difference. So let's say the nice area you mention above with the deepest blue sky 24/7. Would this be the most ideal area to veg (given weather conditions are good and constant)? Compare to an area that has had say, volcanic ash and has permanently placed a "filter" in the sky causing it to filter out more colors other than orange/red. Would this be the ideal place to flower?