Is 425w of Vero29 LED enough for 4x4

badmofo529

badmofo529

Insanely Active Member
20-30 watts per sqft for veg, and 30-40 for flower with most LED's is what most people shoot for.

Imo the better your environment and plants are dialed in, you can run closer to 40. If everything isn't 100% perfect you would want to be closer to 30.

Edit: in a non co2 supplemented room, I'm sure you can push it further with a co2 rich environment. Also kind of depends on hanging hight and coverage. Strips ran close to the canopy need less power per sqft than cobs or pucks hung higher for proper coverage for example.
 
Streetpro09

Streetpro09

Tester
badmofo529 said:
20-30 watts per sqft for veg, and 30-40 for flower with most LED's is what most people shoot for.

Imo the better your environment and plants are dialed in, you can run closer to 40. If everything isn't 100% perfect you would want to be closer to 30.

Edit: in a non co2 supplemented room, I'm sure you can push it further with a co2 rich environment. Also kind of depends on hanging hight and coverage. Strips ran close to the canopy need less power per sqft than cobs or pucks hung higher for proper coverage for example.
Click to expand...
How about for hids? Sry didn't realize there was different wattage requirements for led vs. hids.
 
DET—PDX

DET—PDX

Insanely Active Member
Uncle Romulus said:
I find 45 watt per sq/f the most i want to use with hps without a shit ton of air moving through or c02. With led I feel 40 would be overkill even for most setups. I’ve seen great results with 25-30 even
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The only issue I can think of is coverage. I wanted to just buy one of Timber’s set ups, and their 425w is rated at 3.5 x 3.5 ft coverage area. The total wattage is 425w and its PAR wattage is 200 PAR watts, and is dimmable. If I were to go with their smaller 320w set up, the coverage would only be 2x4. I trust these coverages based on my experience with Timber’s 640w redwood, which was just enough to cover a 5x5 with slight lack in the corners.

I should just build my own fixture with one of their kits, and use my own spread out frame.
 
NoWaistedSpace

NoWaistedSpace

PICK YOUR OWN
I'll run Meanwell HLG480-1400m,A type A driver with 9 Vero's in a 3 x 4 tent. 4 x 4+, around 720 . 900. in a 5 x 5 or a 4 x 6 area. I have about 20 vero 29's running at low wattage in a 5 x 5 space normally. I have plenty of intensity to play around with, plus, lower temps on the components and the environment.
I think 6 vero 29's, at 2100mA(480 watts) is close for a 3 x 4 or 9 at 1400ma. You're gonna need 12 Vero's to get the spread and penetration for a 4 x 4 to be proud of.
COBs don't have the spread like QB's or 301B strips. COB's are more for big plants and "uneven" canopies. It's more about a growers individual growing method and strains.
Sorry, I get to "babbling" when I'm medicated. lol
3500K is good for veg and flower.
Also,
don't quote me on this, but I think your bottom leaves should get at min 250 PAR. Below this and they are no longer contributing to the plants benefit.
 
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crimsonecho

crimsonecho

Self-Proclaimed Don Quixote
DET—PDX said:
The only issue I can think of is coverage. I wanted to just buy one of Timber’s set ups, and their 425w is rated at 3.5 x 3.5 ft coverage area. The total wattage is 425w and its PAR wattage is 200 PAR watts, and is dimmable. If I were to go with their smaller 320w set up, the coverage would only be 2x4. I trust these coverages based on my experience with Timber’s 640w redwood, which was just enough to cover a 5x5 with slight lack in the corners.

I should just build my own fixture with one of their kits, and use my own spread out frame.
Click to expand...
Thats the way to do it bro. Even this basic setup provides complete coverage in a 4x4 for me. If i choose to fill the tent that is. Diy is the most sensible path to take imo. The fixtures are just too small. Or the ones that aren’t are pretty pricey.

190CB0C4-14C4-4BAB-8E9D-C582675C7A6E.jpeg
 
Uncle Romulus

Uncle Romulus

madman, scholar
NoWaistedSpace said:
I'll run Meanwell HLG480-1400m,A type A driver with 9 Vero's in a 3 x 4 tent. 4 x 4+, around 720 . 900. in a 5 x 5 or a 4 x 6 area. I have about 20 vero 29's running at low wattage in a 5 x 5 space normally. I have plenty of intensity to play around with, plus, lower temps on the components and the environment.
I think 6 vero 29's, at 2100mA(480 watts) is close for a 3 x 4 or 9 at 1400ma. You're gonna need 12 Vero's to get the spread and penetration for a 4 x 4 to be proud of.
COBs don't have the spread like QB's or 301B strips. COB's are more for big plants and "uneven" canopies. It's more about a growers individual growing method and strains.
Sorry, I get to "babbling" when I'm medicated. lol
Click to expand...
As more of an hid user, this is the main thing that’s keeping me from setting up led. I want to just throw 4-6 cobs in my 5x5 but it’s sounding like I need a lot more. Seems like you need close to the same watts as hid also. Sure nice to save cooling in summer tho. But shit is it nice to hang one or two dirty ol 600 s and plug em in and grow 😆. I’m starting to think the strips and or qb s are going to be the way I go with leds
 
NoWaistedSpace

NoWaistedSpace

PICK YOUR OWN
I think the standard is 550 to 650 watts in a 4 x 4. Most run their COB's about 1400mA. I go down to roughly 800-900mA. It depends on what I am growing. I have the flexibility to grow any size plant.
Strips require a fairly even canopy, cause the mid range LED's peter out at farther distances. I can slam a reflector and a mag lens and push PAR well over 1000 at 3ft to ceiling height gaining spread.
COBs have the power to perform.
 
DET—PDX

DET—PDX

Insanely Active Member
NoWaistedSpace said:
I'll run Meanwell HLG480-1400m,A type A driver with 9 Vero's in a 3 x 4 tent. 4 x 4+, around 720 . 900. in a 5 x 5 or a 4 x 6 area. I have about 20 vero 29's running at low wattage in a 5 x 5 space normally. I have plenty of intensity to play around with, plus, lower temps on the components and the environment.
I think 6 vero 29's, at 2100mA(480 watts) is close for a 3 x 4 or 9 at 1400ma. You're gonna need 12 Vero's to get the spread and penetration for a 4 x 4 to be proud of.
COBs don't have the spread like QB's or 301B strips. COB's are more for big plants and "uneven" canopies. It's more about a growers individual growing method and strains.
Sorry, I get to "babbling" when I'm medicated. lol
3500K is good for veg and flower.
Also,
don't quote me on this, but I think your bottom leaves should get at min 250 PAR. Below this and they are no longer contributing to the plants benefit.
Click to expand...
Yeah I heard a podcast with Dr. Allison Justice and she was explaining the bottom leaves recording at 200 par were just acting as sprinklers respiring water back into the air, I just cut up the bottom 1/3s of my plants ever time now. I’m adding 2 more cobs in the corners of my 5x5 they’re on the way.
 
NoWaistedSpace

NoWaistedSpace

PICK YOUR OWN
CrimsonEcho said:
Thats the way to do it bro. Even this basic setup provides complete coverage in a 4x4 for me. If i choose to fill the tent that is. Diy is the most sensible path to take imo. The fixtures are just too small. Or the ones that aren’t are pretty pricey.

View attachment 10370
Click to expand...
I see you run a complete "mixed" spectrum too. Might add 5 or 10 CREE 660 mids to each bar. Get that "double bump" in the spectrum. Add around a 100 -120 watts of boost.
The Veros do a good job without the 660's. It's just another step up on the ladder.
 
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crimsonecho

crimsonecho

Self-Proclaimed Don Quixote
NoWaistedSpace said:
I see you run a complete "mixed" spectrum too. Might add 5 or 10 CREE 660 mids to each bar. Get that "double bump" in the spectrum. Add around a 100 -120 watts of boost.
The Veros do a good job without the 660's. It's just another step up on the ladder.
Click to expand...
Yeah its possible to improve it in many ways but for a hobby grower it suffices. Maybe in the future when i’m designing a new fixture i might go into mono leds. Couple of UVs too. For now tho it gets the job done.

A8D1B6DB-E8A1-4F97-AF31-58EEADD6D83F.jpeg
 
Highsince76

Highsince76

Super Active Member
DET—PDX said:
The only issue I can think of is coverage. I wanted to just buy one of Timber’s set ups, and their 425w is rated at 3.5 x 3.5 ft coverage area. The total wattage is 425w and its PAR wattage is 200 PAR watts, and is dimmable. If I were to go with their smaller 320w set up, the coverage would only be 2x4. I trust these coverages based on my experience with Timber’s 640w redwood, which was just enough to cover a 5x5 with slight lack in the corners.

I should just build my own fixture with one of their kits, and use my own spread out frame.
Click to expand...
I'm a hobby grower all day long, and when I bought my 4x4 tent couple years back, I did my research on lighting.
What I ended up with was 400 Watt Vero29 V7 3000k purchased from Timber.
According to Timber, this light covers 36" x 36" for flower. That never worked out for me. It ended up covering the entire 4 x 4 out of necessity. lol.
To Damn hard to hold the girls down, but yea, original plan was to use 36" x 36".

I have been very impressed with this light!

So after everything I have read over the last couple years, I have pretty much come to the conclusion that 470 to 500 watts is supposed to be the "sweet spot" for quality led in a 4 x 4.
I always ran the Veros at 50 to 70%. Use a Kill-A-Watt meter and mostly ran around 250 watts at the wall.
So knowing what 250 watts of COB has done for me, I would like to see the difference another 250 watts thrown in there will make.
I want to check out that "sweet spot", see what it's about.
I know I can double the wattage, but just how much will potency and quantity increase is the question? And what does it increase most?
No way it'll get close to doubling in either category.
But we'll find out soon.

Bodhi Space Monkey
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