Ph question

[GetOffMyNutes]

So I only so soil but I want to pay attention to the ph levels of my water. I used distilled water and throw in my recharge and nutes per watering. Should I test the ph before I add my nutes or after? Distilled water ph is about 5.4 so I'm thinking I should boost it to about 6?

 

[Zaphod420]

So I only so soil but I want to pay attention to the ph levels of my water. I used distilled water and throw in my recharge and nutes per watering. Should I test the ph before I add my nutes or after? Distilled water ph is about 5.4 so I'm thinking I should boost it to about 6?

I would say after just in case any of your recharge or nutes spikes your ph in one particular direction or the other. As long as it isn't ridiculous out of range from what I have heard a good soil can pretty much work with whatever you give it.

 

[Old ST1R]

I wouldn’t pH at all in soil. You don’t need to and what ever you’re using to pH can build up in the soil and fuck up your plants.

But if you must, adjust pH after all your nutes are added.

 

[GetOffMyNutes]

Well I appreciate the feedback ,I never tested it before just thought maybe it was something that I should have been checking. I keep the roots pretty happy, just always on the look out to improve.

 

[H.A.F.]

Well I appreciate the feedback ,I never tested it before just thought maybe it was something that I should have been checking. I keep the roots pretty happy, just always on the look out to improve.

I agree with the no-pHing thing. Took me a while to get to that point and I now have about $100 worth of pH pen, up and down... sitting in the corner feeling lonely. I think the big push about it came along with the advanced salt-based nutes that pretty much required it. That and hydro where the effects of anything you do to the water can be seen in hours.

If I was to invest in something it would be a cheap R/O filter set-up. For the price of a decent pH pen you get 8-12 months of 0ppm water on demand.

 

[Deleted member 60]

I wasn't a fan of the way the RO machines waste water to get what you get....but I was on "city" water at the time...so it wasn't a concern like it would be now with a well. Cycling that pump could cause more problems than yer trying to fix...heehee...nah....no thanks.

I pH my water for my outdoor here/there because the water out of the creek sits @ about 8.3. (but fortunately...also sits @ 80ppm) I get that "soil" buffers shit...but who is using real soil for their grows? I'm sure those in the ground are to an extent...IF their soil is golden/in the zone pH wise/etc....but I'm in a roughly 20% OF, 20% coco, 15% peat and 45% perlite.....so no "soil" to speak of. It's basically an OF/coco heavy..... "almost hempy" bucket grow. (water runs through very easily and they dry out in a day or so...even in 20's and 30's).

I guarantee if you water time and time again with water that is above 8.0 (or on the case of my well...almost 9.0)....shit isn't gonna turn out as well as it could. (none of my indoor grows have truly been on par since moving here). Thankfully the OD carries me through the entire year so indoors is "just for fun" if I do it. I also pH'd my water for my "flush" for a few waterings when I changed from the nitrogen heavy 15-21-2 fert to a P-K only feed and used water only (never done this before cus I was always organic)...and I plan to do this again during the the last 2 weeks or so without nutes. (which is upon me right now)

When I went from the N heavy nute and did the first flush I saw accelerated growth over the next few days as the nutes present all became available....so I think it does break shit free in there and make things more available. Not something I do EVERY watering.....but I'm not afraid to mix things up a bit occasionally..... and I don't carry any bro-science in my head about any of it. That's nuts. Nothing is cut and dried in WeedWorld. (until yer buds are finished, that is) And if you haven't grown with 8-9 pH water thorugh multiple grows to see the effects and truly know WTF you are talking about...well...I'll stop there.

Anyone else playing with crazy high (or low) pH'd well water? Do you just let things fly (and die...LOL)....or do you take control?

 

[H.A.F.]

I get that "soil" buffers shit...but who is using real soil for their grows?

When you have a mix of peat or coco (which eventually becomes castings) rocks, compost, a layer of weeds (cover crop) feeding nitrogen to it, worms and microbes doing all they do, what part isn't 'soil'?

 

[H.A.F.]

I guarantee if you water time and time again with water that is above 8.0 (or on the case of my well...almost 9.0)....shit isn't gonna turn out as well as it could.

That is the draw of the RO water - makes it all work. Get a bottle of distilled (7.0/0ppm) and try adjustting the pH to 6.5. A single drop of down can shoot it past the mark because it is the only ppm in the water. It is completely neutral. Your well water might be 9.0 pH, but how many initial ppm does it have? How much pH-down do you actually add (ppm-wise) to get it to the pH you want? It's really not that much change, so the soil performing the same fucntion is not that crazy.

If you have to use unfiltered well water straight then adjusting the pH would make sense because there is nothing but mostly dead medium and salt-nutes in your pot. No biome/rhizosphere to take the input and adjust it. If you had a complete living soil environment it would be fine. With salts and soil it's like hydro-lite. The buffer you get from it is the time and intensity difference over using straight hydro.

You are manually growing your plants. You can mis-measure something and screw it up. You can master the system and have no problems, but it's about you, not the plant. Less so than in hydro but the same theory. The need for flushing is the clue. If you weren't putting bad stuff in, why would you need to flush? With straight organic I have perfect white ash and stucky buds. I am just harvesting my first from the worm-soil, and I have no clue if it will be better or worse than just 'organic-ish' like I was doing. But it damn sure is easier and cheaper. For the same or better results I can live with that.

Not arguing as much as playing devil's advocate. Food for thought type stuff.

 

[H.A.F.]

They have also found out since all the intensive testing for edibles and such that putting stuff on the plant in veg does still effect it in flower. Flushing does not remove stuff at a cellular level.

Either you put a chemical in your plant and the plant absorbs and uses it (takeds it in at a cellular level) or it doesn't. If it doesn't you wasted the $$ on nutes, if it uses them it is there - on a cellular level. If there are any heavy metals, arsenic or mercury from fish, any of the really bad stuff - flushing does nothing.

 

[Deleted member 60]

I'm guessing you spend extraodinarily amounts of time fuckin with yer grow/focusing on weed from the amount of time you spend here. (that's a lotta posts) That's cool....but I'm outta that mode after all those years of making bank/being tied to a grow. Too much "life" going on/other shit going on here to play follow the leader with all of the "experts" that are out there these days.

I get that 'living soil' s the trendy new bro thing right now...and that's muy cool if that is the way you wanna grow. FWIW...I don't do "cover crops" here on my outdoor grow. Just not how I play. I'm not tending small pots in tents in a super controlled environment. I'd be out there all day in this <15% humidity trying to keep the top inch wet so the shit didn't croak. It's a brutal environment at times. It hasn't rained here in almost a month now. I see no benefit in such a thing when there are a zillion sources of N out there that are easily acquired. I spend mucho time here trying to keep the forest from creeping in on me....weeds (cover crops) included. That's why the floor of my grow/garden is 20+ year weed paper....LOL. Fuck that shit.

No worries here about heavy metals. Organics have em as well. It's all about the levels present. The ferts I'm using have minimal amounts. Less than the city folks get just breathing the "air". (on a cellular level..they are SO fucked)

Even if I wanted to fuck with it/play that way....from what I've experienced running them extensively decades ago.....an RO machine simply couldn't keep up with the watering needs I have on the outdoor grow. 75 gallons per day go on these girls right now.....sometimes more if it's 90+F. Been there...done that.....and I'm not using a 'tap" for a water source so it would be muy hard to pull off via a sprinkler pump/hose and 75 psi. These grows are already a lot of daily work.....and there's no need to fuss and faunch over any of it. It's second nature here. I do what I always do to an extent.... tweeking shit here/there as needed/wanted.

The old "organics is best...." is an argument I've had for years cus it's the only way I've really ever played other than my hydro/RDWC/DWC/Undercurrent years. I've been a solid participant in the organic camp for decades....and after 30+ years at this shit...I fully understand the parameters/differences of each method. I just decided to change shit up across the board this year and dump the all organic approach and see where things would go. (the ferts I'm using have a kelp/humic base with added chem NPK)

FWIW....my gardens have never flourished like this. It's truly blowing me away. Never seen so many tomatoes on one plant....and there are 90 of em.

and those buds....oh my....gonna be a banner year here even if it all kills me when I eat it/smoke it

 

[treefarmercharlie]

FWIW...I don't do "cover crops" here on my outdoor grow. Just not how I play. I'm not tending small pots in tents in a super controlled environment. I'd be out there all day in this <15% humidity trying to keep the top inch wet so the shit didn't croak. It's a brutal environment at times. It hasn't rained here in almost a month now. I see no benefit in such a thing when there are a zillion sources of N out there that are easily acquired.

The cover crop actually helps prevent the top soil from drying out because it shades the top of the soil from the sun/lights. When I run a cover crop, that's honestly the only reason I use it. The amount of N it can put back into the soil is so minimal in indoor grows that it's not worth maintaining a cover crop for the purpose of maintaining N levels.

 

[Deleted member 60]

Mulch will blow away a cover crop for moisture retention. It may make a small difference if I were to use it....but with a super light mix and 15% humidity/90F in fabric pots... things will dry out here...cover crop/mulch or not. I kinda planned it that way this season and know that I'm 'on duty" for the duration as far as the watering goes. No rest for the wicked and all...and no worries. Seeing the light at the end of the tunnel now...

 

[H.A.F.]

75 gallons per day go on these girls right now.....

How many plants is that? I am lowering the count as we speak but I had over 20 plants going and was using about 3 gallons per day.
I am using about a quart (1000ml pitcher) per plant every other day with the occasional deep-soak that might use up to a gallon.

 

[H.A.F.]

The cover crop actually helps prevent the top soil from drying out because it shades the top of the soil from the sun/lights. When I run a cover crop, that's honestly the only reason I use it. The amount of N it can put back into the soil is so minimal in indoor grows that it's not worth maintaining a cover crop for the purpose of maintaining N levels.

To be clear, I am not counting on them to provide N - they just do. Go outside and dig up a shovel-full of dirt under the grass, then where there's bare ground. The worms go to the place where the grass is. That is the main reason I have the cover crop. Simulate nature and keep the worms happy and everything else should fall in line.

I'm guessing you spend extraodinarily amounts of time fuckin with yer grow/focusing on weed from the amount of time you spend here.

Actually it is just my hobby. I wish I had more to do with the plants besides stare at them, take pics, and talk about them on here.

 

[Deleted member 60]

Yup...just a hobby here as well right now. However...I did make a nice living at it "back in the day". ('90-2015) Hobby growing is far less stessful but the pay kinda sucks....

LOL...TRY to dig here. You aren't gonna find many worms. BAM..BAM...BAM......Rocks and sand...yes......worms.....possibly.....but this isn't the East/Midwest, for sure. Unless yer in my yard....it just isn't wet enough for worms in most places here..... or cover crops unless they are native, hygroscopic plants. Bottom line here....I'm focusing on the weed...not the grass.