The James Gang

[H.A.F.]

Anyway, I'm an analytical type of dude, and I wanted a system to keep me in a variety of smoke. I gift some to family but that's about it. So more/smaller plants, dry top-dressings for nutes, and the three gallon pots means a quart of water will water a plant. and I don't need run-off because the nutes are organic. Makes overfeeding tough too. I have seen some high ppm run-off numbers when I checked.

Also, if I don't care for a strain as much I can hash the lot and make budder and not feel bad. Didn't spend 4-5 months working on a pound. Or strains that I have had in the jar over a year get processed as well.

 

[Streetpro09]

If I wanted weight I would just need to veg longer and train more. Doing a manifold for 8-tops instead of 4 is the easiest still keeping my style of grow.

You don't have to let them get huge, but the extra time it takes to get them from a 4 top to an 8 top - same height at flip - will let each of those 8 limbs produce the same half ounce per limb. Doing a manifold keeps them shorter, you can still flip them when the tops are only a foot tall, but with the LST each limb is taller than that. But then you need 5 gallon pots.

This is what I'm gonna try to do this time. 8 tops. I'm have to post some pictures in my thread and get your opinion.

Essentially all my plants are WAY too big when I put them in flower. In my opinion. So I figure topping twice might help.

The ones that are in my RDWC system where about 20" or so tall after veg and I topped a couple of those down to 3/4 tops early in veg. Well they streched like a bitch. They at least doubled if not 2.5 times their original height. So I have a hard time just leaving the very tops. I need to get my timing down better. Perpetual is tough to get the hang of when that's where you start.

 

[Streetpro09]

Anyway, I'm an analytical type of dude,

I'm right there with ya. That's why I went the hydro route. It helps if I can "see" what's going on with the nutes in the root area.

 

[H.A.F.]

I'm right there with ya. That's why I went the hydro route. It helps if I can "see" what's going on with the nutes in the root area.

I don't like the worries that go with that. have to be too anal about ppm's and water temps and stuff - dirt is easy.

 

[H.A.F.]

This is what I'm gonna try to do this time. 8 tops. I'm have to post some pictures in my thread and get your opinion.

My young plants in the flower tent were flipped at 28 days, and were about as tall as the one gallon pots they were in when I flipped - maybe a foot tall. If they stretch 3-times that I still have room in the closet. A the 4 in the closet did.

Here's what I have found so far.

4 weeks veg - you can do a 4 top by topping it and leaving 4 good limbs. Usually the first two nodes after the 3-toed leaves.
5 weeks veg - you can do a 4-top mainline/manifold. Top for 2, then top those for two more, or let the other 4-tops get taller.
6 weeks veg - Manifold all the way. Top for two, then four, then eight. And keep each trained low, almost parallel to the soil.

When they get near the edge of the pot with the constant training you let them head north. They are already mature enough at that point to flip, but you can let them get a little height if you want. But remember that the stretch % includes the stuff you have growing sideways. so if it is a foot long from the trunk to the edge of the pot, then the added height, you can get some monsters out of stretchy plants.

 

[Old ST1R]

This is what I'm gonna try to do this time. 8 tops. I'm have to post some pictures in my thread and get your opinion.

Essentially all my plants are WAY too big when I put them in flower. In my opinion. So I figure topping twice might help.

The ones that are in my RDWC system where about 20" or so tall after veg and I topped a couple of those down to 3/4 tops early in veg. Well they streched like a bitch. They at least doubled if not 2.5 times their original height. So I have a hard time just leaving the very tops. I need to get my timing down better. Perpetual is tough to get the hang of when that's where you start.

This was 8 - 8 tops (mainlined, not manifolded) in a 2x4. They were all 8-12” tall at flip IIRC.

 

[Streetpro09]

I don't like the worries that go with that. have to be too anal about ppm's and water temps and stuff - dirt is easy.

Yeah I'm a visual learner. So if I can see it I'll pick it up quicker. You're funny. I also like it cause things happen within a day or two instead of a week. (+\- nutes and you can see the difference quick). Idk it just helps me understand what's going on better if I run into a problem. Plus dirt is so damn messy. I live on concrete and tile, so if I spill I wipe it up quick and the rest dries. Much cleaner for me. Though like I said, I'm a glutin for punishment, so I just had to run a couple in coco. Luckily that's not to bad.

My young plants in the flower tent were flipped at 28 days, and were about as tall as the one gallon pots they were in when I flipped - maybe a foot tall. If they stretch 3-times that I still have room in the closet. A the 4 in the closet did.

Here's what I have found so far.

4 weeks veg - you can do a 4 top by topping it and leaving 4 good limbs. Usually the first two nodes after the 3-toed leaves.
5 weeks veg - you can do a 4-top mainline/manifold. Top for 2, then top those for two more, or let the other 4-tops get taller.
6 weeks veg - Manifold all the way. Top for two, then four, then eight. And keep each trained low, almost parallel to the soil.

When they get near the edge of the pot with the constant training you let them head north. They are already mature enough at that point to flip, but you can let them get a little height if you want. But remember that the stretch % includes the stuff you have growing sideways. so if it is a foot long from the trunk to the edge of the pot, then the added height, you can get some monsters out of stretchy plants.

That's helpful but who knows what happens in hydro. The ones I just put into flower have 6 weeks of veg outta the cloner and I topped them twice but not the right way.

I topped the main stems first and left 4 good shoots that were all growing about equal. Then I topped those 4 after letting them grow for while and tieing each brach down to the top of the bucket. They are too big at flower. I probably don't top soon enough is what I'm thinking.

So back to the little ones I've already topped once. With the way you explained it I'll need to top them again like tonight. So I'll take some pictures later and get yours and @Old ST1R opinion.

I gotta get some shit done around here. It's already noon!

 

[Streetpro09]

This was 8 - 8 tops (mainlined, not manifolded) in a 2x4. They were all 8-12” tall at flip IIRC.
View attachment 78842

That is exactly what I'm thinking I just don't know what I need to do to get there. That is what my dreams look like at this point. Lmao!

 

[H.A.F.]

That is exactly what I'm thinking I just don't know what I need to do to get there. That is what my dreams look like at this point. Lmao!

The manifold is where you top for two limbs, then keep as many nodes as you want off of those two until you top it. So if you keep 4 on each side you have an 8-top The initial topping kills that apical dominance that makes you have a fat center cola. It allows an even flow of nutes/water to each side of the plant.

The mainline is where instead of keeping the shoots off of those two, you top them and keep tthe first two (4-tops) - then top each of those again for 8. This is better for having 8 even tops.

 

[H.A.F.]

So I'll take some pictures later and get yours and @Old ST1R opinion.

Definitely. I can draw on the pic and repost it to explain stuff.

 

[H.A.F.]

This was 8 - 8 tops (mainlined, not manifolded) in a 2x4. They were all 8-12” tall at flip IIRC.
View attachment 78842

Here was my Paradise Deisel 8-top.

 

[Old ST1R]

Here was my Paradise Deisel 8-top.
View attachment 78845

My current run is 4 Mainlined tops, but I put them into flower when they were much taller than the eight tops.

On another note, it looks like you don’t do any major defoliation? I’m trying it this time, but looking at past grows where I didn’t do much, they seem to be further along in Bud development that the defoliated plants. Maybe they’ll catch up and exceed the others. We’ll see

 

[H.A.F.]

My current run is 4 Mainlined tops, but I put them into flower when they were much taller than the eight tops.

On another note, it looks like you don’t do any major defoliation? I’m trying it this time, but looking at past grows where I didn’t do much, they seem to be further along in Bud development that the defoliated plants. Maybe they’ll catch up and exceed the others. We’ll see

That's relative. I snip the lower stuff clean for airflow- maybe two or three nodes. After I flip I prune all the lower shoots but leave the fan leaves. I'll snip middle ones all the way to the top so I can bunch the tops together, but I have some lower fan leaves that stay on until harvest time.

 

[H.A.F.]

I used to prune shoots in veg to try and get the tops to grow quicker, but with the short veg it's not worth the hassle - and it also leaves me good viable clones after I find girls if needed - so I leave most of them on until flip now.

 

[Old ST1R]

That's relative. I snip the lower stuff clean for airflow- maybe two or three nodes. After I flip I prune all the lower shoots but leave the fan leaves. I'll snip middle ones all the way to the top so I can bunch the tops together, but I have some lower fan leaves that stay on until harvest time.

I did a similar technique on that pic I posted above ^^^, and unless things turn around on this grow where I did quite a major defoliation of almost all the large fan leaves, I’m going back to the other way.

 

[H.A.F.]

I did a similar technique on that pic I posted above ^^^, and unless things turn around on this grow where I did quite a major defoliation of almost all the large fan leaves, I’m going back to the other way.

The tops are all that matters for me - as long as they get light the few nugs under it will grow. I have leaves that die from being against the wall, or naturally from being shaded. If they look like they are doing more harm than good I pluck them

 

[H.A.F.]

I ditched the wonky Muffin. Yesterday I pruned off the bad limb a node below the mess, thinking it might keep two decent smaller tops. Today the other three started yellowing. Not worth the fight, and now I have symmetry back

 

[H.A.F.]

I did a similar technique on that pic I posted above ^^^, and unless things turn around on this grow where I did quite a major defoliation of almost all the large fan leaves, I’m going back to the other way.

Here's a technique pic. Ask away if I don't 'splain it.

You can zoom in and see how I left the leaves but pruned the shoots on the SC to the left. Older plants, good airflow for the low fan, and you can see from the lvtk bendy-limb on the right that even the low stuff has some weight to it. Nugs on the Left Behind in the back as well. Big chunks.
I keep pruning the lower shoots until I see pistils, then once they get furry tops I may take a few more lowers if they are long.

 

[H.A.F.]

lvtk s1 by @thenotsoesoteric

Getting nice amber on the rails, not much elsewhere but it's damn close.

Same with the Cheap Thrills- decent fade starting on this.

This one I'm watching close because of the new growth everywhere. Just dreading seeing nanners popping but so far none. But a lot of the pistisl come out middle-first, a curl beore they unfold. A few in these pics, and they look like nanners without the loupe.

 

[Big Terps]

This was 8 - 8 tops (mainlined, not manifolded) in a 2x4. They were all 8-12” tall at flip IIRC.
View attachment 78842

Masterpiece there @Old ST1R .. Nice job man!